Terry
Silver Level Member
Posts: 488
Usual Listening Area: east Murray
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Post by Terry on Oct 15, 2023 13:09:54 GMT -6
I’ve been investigating the possibility of creating new translators in the Salt Lake valley. It appears to me that there are only 2 frequencies possibly available. Each would have coverage almost identical to the current translator on 99.1.
It seems to me that the most likely users of these potential translators are KSOP’s HD2 (KSOP-AM classic country but in FM stereo) and KUDD’s HD2 (“KOOL-FM” oldies, still missing from the standard FM dial).
So, what is keeping them from using these possibilities? 1. They don’t know it’s possible. 2. It is, in fact, impossible and I’m a crackpot amateur. 3. The cost is not worth the possible reward. 4. Something else?
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Post by kenglish on Oct 15, 2023 15:43:14 GMT -6
I don't think there is more than (maybe) one non-adjacent FM frequency left in the SLC market. Not sure what the latest rules are, but, in the "Rock, scissors, paper" world of frequency use, I think a translator would not trump a LPFM, which would not trump a full-power.... you'd have to purchase a frequency from an existing licensee. I tell people all the time, there just aren't any "empty" channels.
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Terry
Silver Level Member
Posts: 488
Usual Listening Area: east Murray
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Post by Terry on Oct 15, 2023 16:01:09 GMT -6
Consider 96.7 and 92.9 with facilities identical to 99.1.
What would preclude them?
The 45 dBu contours of the Tremonton boosters don’t overlap the 45 dBu contour of 99.1. The 45 dBu contours of the Lake Mountain translators don’t appear to overlap the contour of 99.1 either.
The only possible problem I see is the KRCL 96.7 translator in Park City.
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Post by kenglish on Oct 16, 2023 8:55:58 GMT -6
99.1 is really an odd translator. It's located on the high-rise residential building next to Rice Stadium (east bench), and only runs about 235 watts. IIRC, that translator has been moved, sold, and rented so many times, it must have a trailer hitch on it. Wasn't that located low in the Oquirrhs, operating on 105 years ago, as a fill-in for the east bench, for one of the early non-comms? Anyone wanting to "fix" a bad AM signal should look for something that more thoroughly covers the valley, and is located nearer to the existing antenna farms on the west.
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Post by CAwasinNJ on Oct 17, 2023 3:06:57 GMT -6
Translators are limited to a maximum of 250 watts so "only" running 235 isn't all that big of a deal. Of course with FM height is king and transmitting from downtown Salt Lake isn't going to reach nearly as far as from the top of a mountain. There's also the problem of being shadowed to the north by those hills. 99.1 has been owned by iHeart or its predecessors since the 90's and as far as I can remember has always retransmitted 99.5, either the main or more recently a subchannel. It used to be on Lake Mountain but had to move when what was then KUDE moved from 103.9 to 99.1. Ken, you might be thinking of KCPW's translator that started out on 105.1 in Murray before moving to 105.3 in the Oquirrhs before eventually becoming today's 105.5 simulcasting Bob. Whether any particular frequency could be used for a translator depends on more than just co-channel stations. You'd have to look at first, second and third adjacent stations as well as any stations 10.6 or 10.8 MHz away too. The whole gory mess is at www.ecfr.gov/current/title-47/chapter-I/subchapter-C/part-74/subpart-L/section-74.1204 if you want to take a look at it.
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Terry
Silver Level Member
Posts: 488
Usual Listening Area: east Murray
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Post by Terry on Oct 17, 2023 9:58:37 GMT -6
Thanks, CA. That link will give me hours of fun trying to comprehend the always mysterious FCC rules.
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Post by kenglish on Oct 17, 2023 10:37:45 GMT -6
Same here...thanks CA. I wasn't going to go too much beyond the lack of open channels, until I could find some official and current FCC info. That's getting hard to find, since the FCC changed their site around.
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Terry
Silver Level Member
Posts: 488
Usual Listening Area: east Murray
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Post by Terry on Oct 17, 2023 17:05:16 GMT -6
So, according to these rules, no translator can be built within the 60 dBu range of the big Oquirrh Mountain FMs, namely from Brigham City to Payson.
Perhaps this is a recent change? I must have been looking at older rules; the FCC stuff is really messy.
Also, these rules imply that almost any current translator along the Wasatch Front does not comply with these rules. Perhaps they've been grandfathered in?
92.1 had its license granted in June 2022. That suggests to me that the rules changed after that.
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Post by kenglish on Oct 17, 2023 17:58:47 GMT -6
You might want to chat with Michi at recnet.com, and see what she knows about all this.
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Post by CAwasinNJ on Oct 18, 2023 7:36:05 GMT -6
I went back as far as I could to the oldest version of those rules (2017) and the 60dBu is the same. The "protected contour" column doesn't make sense for at least two reasons. One is that it would mean any area with a reasonable population of stations wouldn't be able to have many, if any, translators. That just makes no sense. The other is that the spacing requirements between co-channel stations is wildly different from a second or third adjacent station. Having the same signal strength requirement makes even less sense. I'll see if I can come up with a better answer, but I'm not optimistic.
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