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Post by CAwasinNJ on Nov 6, 2022 21:49:41 GMT -6
As a matter of fact, I think I'm hearing them on 1150 right now, using Synchronous AM Lower mode, with the loop antenna carefully nulled against KSL. Hearing who?
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Post by kenglish on Nov 6, 2022 22:17:33 GMT -6
1150 from Montana....maybe. It's sports, coming in pretty weak, and their streaming has an announcement saying they don't have the rights to stream "the game". So, maybe that's who I hear just below KSL, where the digital should normally be.
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Post by David on Nov 7, 2022 10:20:52 GMT -6
There was an STA filed Oct 28. Per the filing, "Station KTUB(AM), Centerville, UT, facility ID 69557, went silent October 17, 2022 due to the loss of site lease and dismantlement of the towers." It sounds like they won't be back for quite some time. Adding to the complexity is their highly directional nighttime pattern. There are several possibilities, but is it worth it to create a new site? I must be using the wrong website to access the FCC's database. I use fccinfo.com to look up a station's public access files, and I'm still not seeing an STA for KTUB. From the text of KTUB's STA, it sounds like another Salt Lake/Ogden/Provo AM tower site has been lost to real estate developers. By my count, this makes seven AM stations which have lost their tower sites to developers: KTKK, KWDZ, KFNZ, KNFL (Tremonton), KOGN, KLLB, and now KTUB. Makes me wonder how much longer KSL, KNRS, and KZNS will remain on AM. Moreover, KMRI is still off the air almost three years after the 2020 Salt Lake City earthquake, so who knows if 1550 will ever return to the air. Oh well, it's just the nature of AM broadcasting in the USA in the 21st century. 😕 |
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Post by CAwasinNJ on Nov 7, 2022 16:27:40 GMT -6
It's listed in the FCC public files, though the hyperlink at the application list is only going to a blank page right now for some reason. Make sure that what you're looking at are actually the public inspection files. The other links at fccinfo.com are to the old CDBS which aren't going to help.
KTKK lost their site back in the last century so I don't think that counts. They were operating under STA's from KLLB's site. Both KSL and KZNS' sites are out in the middle of nowhere and don't look like land anyone would want, plus I wouldn't be surprised if there were all sorts of environmental issues with developing any further at either location. KNRS is right off Redwood Road and would certainly be in a good location for development, but that area apparently is a "Wetland Observation Area." KTUB's now former site is already pretty much surrounded by development, so that seems like a different case.
Nearby there's also KALL's site. I'm not an engineer but that looks promising to me as a new site where KTUB could go. It's already out in the middle of the Legacy Nature Preserve and there are already 5 towers there which could help with KTUB's directional pattern. We'll have to see.
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Post by radiowyoming on Nov 7, 2022 19:56:39 GMT -6
There was an STA filed Oct 28. Per the filing, "Station KTUB(AM), Centerville, UT, facility ID 69557, went silent October 17, 2022 due to the loss of site lease and dismantlement of the towers." It sounds like they won't be back for quite some time. Adding to the complexity is their highly directional nighttime pattern. There are several possibilities, but is it worth it to create a new site?
No way 1600 will come back with 3 towers.... to rebuild that youre looking at $250,000 or so. If they come back at all, on AM, it'll be a single tower... thats maybe $50,000 for a single tower
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Post by David on Nov 8, 2022 14:33:45 GMT -6
There was an STA filed Oct 28. Per the filing, "Station KTUB(AM), Centerville, UT, facility ID 69557, went silent October 17, 2022 due to the loss of site lease and dismantlement of the towers." It sounds like they won't be back for quite some time. Adding to the complexity is their highly directional nighttime pattern. There are several possibilities, but is it worth it to create a new site? No way 1600 will come back with 3 towers.... to rebuild that youre looking at $250,000 or so. If they come back at all, on AM, it'll be a single tower... thats maybe $50,000 for a single tower
That would be the most economical way for Alpha Media to get KTUB back on the air, but it would also require some modifications to the station's license. From the research I've done, it appears that KTUB was using all three of its towers at night for the specified directional pattern. For KTUB to go non-directional at night would require a drastic drop in post-sunset power output, probably similar the modification of KIHU's nighttime signal after 1550's tower collapsed in the March 2020 earthquake. Of course, there's always the possibility that 1600 could diplex its signal from the KALL site as CA mentioned, or perhaps the KMES site further north. I don't think Alpha Media would have bothered to file a remain silent STA if they didn't intend to do something with the license; then again, we all know what happened with KWDZ after iHeart fooled around with STA's for the station's license for almost three years. 🙄 |
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Post by kenglish on Nov 8, 2022 15:37:02 GMT -6
I'm starting to wonder how many AM stations could multiplex on to one tower, at a common Community site
To get the bandwidth and some semblance of the existing patterns, would it be possible to create patterns by using several vertically polarized log-periodic antennas off one set of towers, switching between antennas from day to night? Might have to switch a set of wires here and there, to make a sharp null in some specific direction.
The FCC may be ready to change some rules, to keep up with the reality of the times.
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Post by amanuensis on Nov 8, 2022 16:39:45 GMT -6
I wonder how much revenue KTUB is actually losing from not broadcasting? Some expenses, such as power, would be reduced if they never sign back on the air but instead continue as an Internet-only station. I have no idea how much less advertisers would be willing to pay. Would advertisers be accepting of metrics based on how many devices are taking the stream? If an advertiser wants to reach Latino Jazz fans, buying a spot on KTUB might still be the best way to do that.
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Post by David on Nov 8, 2022 19:14:16 GMT -6
Alpha Media has two FM Spanish language stations in Salt Lake City, so they could always move the Utah Jazz games in Espanol to one of KTUB'S sister stations. Capital Broadcasting moved the Weber State football and basketball games to KLO-FM after they sold 1430 to El Sembrador, and other than a few negative comments from listeners after the WSU broadcasts first started airing on 103.1, I haven't noticed that it's had much long term impact on The Wave's ratings. In response to Ken's comments about diplexing multiple AM signals from the same tower site, Tri-County Broadcasting in Sauk Rapids, MN has four AM stations broadcasting from one tower site utilizing seven different AM towers. I don't even want to think about what an engineering nightmare setting up that site was! 😉
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Post by CAwasinNJ on Nov 9, 2022 6:00:51 GMT -6
There's going to have to be a modification of KTUB's license regardless of the number of towers since it will be at a new site, so that's not much of an issue. The big problem are the nulls to the WNW and SW from the current site. Accommodating those with a non-directional pattern I think would mean a basically unusable power at night, as David mentioned. That's a particular problem since it's Spanish sports, right? Most sports happens at night and if few listeners can even hear it....
The fact that an STA was filed doesn't mean anything. Even if there is only a 10% chance of relocating the station, filing is a small price to pay (if the fee is even applicable) to hedge their bet.
(Side note: KIHU has NOT modified the technical parameters of its license since 2005. It's currently operating under STA.)
Extrapolating what might happen if KTUB live sports were moved to one of the FM's based on what happened with KLO-FM doesn't work. There really is no alternative (pun intended) to KLO. If that's the music you want, you have to listen there. Alpha's stations have competition. Also, KLO's demos are completely different from any of Alpha's stations.
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Post by oldiesfunhouse on Nov 10, 2022 19:16:32 GMT -6
Well, there's sort of an alternative (continuing the intended pun) to KLO which is KXRK HD2, X96 classic. Isn't that essentially the same music as KLO? I know not a ton of people have HD radios but they are also available as an Alexa skill. I would think people in that demo would be young enough that HD/streaming would be an option. … Right? Or not.
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Post by CAwasinNJ on Nov 11, 2022 5:41:08 GMT -6
If you want to expand outside of the sphere of radio then you've got more choices than you could ever listen to. That's a completely different topic.
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Post by kenglish on Nov 11, 2022 16:05:04 GMT -6
When you said "choices", I immediately thought, "How many different sites, systems and apps are there, to listen to every version of streaming?"
Not sure if I could lift my phone 🙄.
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Post by David on Nov 20, 2022 12:20:13 GMT -6
FWIW: I'm not fluent in Spanish, but earlier this morning I heard a sporting event on 102.3 KDUT which sounded like it could be the 2022 World Cup.
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Post by kenglish on Nov 20, 2022 14:02:48 GMT -6
FWIW: I'm not fluent in Spanish, but earlier this morning I heard a sporting event on 102.3 KDUT which sounded like it could be the 2022 World Cup. I think they show that on their schedule. |
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